When recently, on a visit to southern India, I saw so many new churches , I got the idea to write an open letter to Pope Francis. He is getting a lot of praise for his ‘bold’ statements in the west. However, so far he only talks about ‘respectful coexistence of religions’. He needs to walk his talk and stop conversion. Here is my letter:
Respected Holy Father,
Great hope for a positive change in the Catholic Church is pinned on your Pontificate and recent statements indicate that this hope may not be misplaced. The future, your Holiness said in November 2013, is in the “respectful coexistence of diversity and in the fundamental right to religious freedom in all its dimensions, and not in muting the different voices of religion”.
This statement makes eminent sense and would need to be implemented by all who presently do not subscribe to a respectful coexistence of diversity in regard to religions. However, I sense (wrongly maybe) that it is a plea for other religions to respect Christianity, rather than a commitment by the Church to respect other religions. To be precise, since Christians are occasionally persecuted in Islamic countries, it seems to be an appeal to ‘live and let live’ between the two biggest religions on earth.
Your Holiness is aware that both, Christianity and Islam, claim to be the only true religion and their God, respectively Allah alone is true. Both religions further hold that all people on earth have to accept this claim and join their particular religion to be saved and reach heaven or paradise. Both give a serious warning to those who don’t join: they will land up eternally in hell. These claims of exclusiveness are made without any evidence whatsoever, apart from the fact that the claims contradict each other, as both cannot be true. They require blind belief, and as blind, unreasonable belief is not natural for human beings, for many centuries it was enforced with state power and indoctrinated right from childhood with the fear of hell as the boogeyman.
May I ask Your Holiness to ponder how the respectful coexistence of diversity and the fundamental right to religious freedom is possible as long as these claims of exclusiveness are in place? Were these claims originally made to gain political power or were they made in the interest of the spiritual welfare of humanity? And may I also ask whether Your Holiness personally believes in these claims?
I trust that privately, Your Holiness does not believe in them, as media reported your statement that good atheists also will be redeemed. In other words, they won’t go automatically to hell. However, the Vatican took pains to clarify that Your Holiness did not mean it. Even my mother, 95 and a staunch Catholic all her life, expressed dismay that a perfectly sensible statement by the Pope was watered down.
Your Holiness may feel compelled for worldly reasons to stick to the claim of exclusiveness as dropping it would entail wrapping up all conversion attempts and in the process lose power, wealth and influence. Further there may be fear that other Christian denominations will not go along and will gain an advantage over the Catholic Church. Still another worry may be that Islam will not drop the claim of exclusiveness and will push aggressively for conversion.
However, the Catholic Church was the first institution to put up this baseless claim, which has brought unspeakable disaster upon humankind. From this claim the Church derived not only the ‘right’, but the ‘duty’ to storm across the globe and impose forcefully her ‘belief system’ – in Europe, in the Americas and in Africa and now in Asia. It was no doubt an ingenious ploy to claim that God wants everyone to become Christian. . Mark Twain famously said, “Religion was born when the first con-man met the first fool”. I would change it, “Dogmatic religion was born when ….”.
Some centuries later, Islam followed suit, claiming that Allah wants everyone to accept Islam, and we all know the violent conflicts resulting from those unsubstantiated claims. Since the Catholic Church started this disastrous trend, she needs to reverse it. The welfare of humanity as a whole has to be the concern and not the welfare of a religious institution. Hopefully Your Holiness has the courage to make a real, clear change for the better and will not fall for hairsplitting theological arguments, like ‘redemption is possible but not salvation’, etc.
Most Christians especially in Europe don’t believe anymore in unreasonable claims. The sad thing is that together with the dogmas, many reject belief in God altogether. They have not learnt to listen to their conscience and to enquire into truth, as the Church has played the role of the conscience- and truth-keeper for too long. The consequences for our societies are there for everyone to see.
However, many Christians do start pondering and believe in a ‘great power’, but not in the Christian God. For example, when I asked some fifty Christians in Germany whether they believe that Hindus who heard about Jesus Christ, but do not convert, will go to hell, nobody said yes. Even a priest said no. And not a single German I met was in favour of missionary activity in India. Yet Pope John Paul II declared in India the intention of the Church to plant the cross in Asia in the new millennium and considered India as a field for a rich harvest, which goes completely against ‘respectful coexistence’.
I live in India since 33 years and can assert with full confidence that India has no need of Christian missionaries, and yet huge sums of money are being pumped in to lure converts with material benefits and to build churches. I am aware that Your Holiness is responsible only for Catholics and not for the myriad of other Christian denominations that prey on poor Hindus, but if the Catholic Church made a start of truly respecting Hindus, it would have a big impact.
Maybe Your Holiness is under the impression that Hinduism is a depraved religion and Hindus would do well to accept the Christian God instead of their multiple Gods.
Such an impression would be completely wrong. There is no other religion that is – unjustly – denigrated as badly as Hinduism. Sorry to say that Christian (including Catholic) missionaries are in the forefront of this vilification campaign. Few people in the west know how profound India’s ancient tradition is.
Long before ‘religions’, as we know them today, came into being, ancient India knew about a solid philosophical basis for our existence and helpful tenets for a fulfilling and meaningful life. The only addition Christianity brought in anew, are unverifiable dogmas that cannot possibly have a bearing on the absolute Truth. Can an event in history impact the absolute Truth? Will Truth make a distinction between people who are baptized and those who are not? “There is no salvation outside the Church” is, and I may be excused for using strong language, ridiculous.
The Indian rishis had discovered ages ago that an all-pervading Presence is at the core of this universe, indescribable, but best described as absolute consciousness. Further, the Hindu law of karma preceded by ages the Christian dictum “as you sow so you reap’.
A Council stopped Christians from believing in rebirth which would explain many riddles that trouble them, for example why there is great injustice already at birth?
The advantage of having a perfect person as a friend and guide on the spiritual path was known in India, but till some 2000 years ago nobody claimed that ‘only’ Krishna or ‘only’ Ram or ‘only’ Buddha can lead to salvation and that whoever does not believe it, goes to hell. “Truth is One, the wise call it by many names”, the Indian Rishis declared and listed different names of Gods. That was at a time, when Christianity was nowhere in sight.
Probably they would have included ‘God’ as another name and Jesus as an avatar, not expecting to be backstabbed by followers of “God” declaring: “Truth must be called only by one name and is fully revealed only in one book.”
The multiple Gods in Hinduism are personified powers that help to access the formless, nameless Presence that is in all of us. Christians in India are told that Hindu Gods are devils. On what basis? Of course there is no basis and it’s an unacceptable insult. Yet in recent years, Christianity tries to revive (inspired by Hinduism?) belief in angels, as devotion for the Invisible is easier by focusing on images.
Hinduism is not a belief system. It is a knowledge system. It is a genuine enquiry into what is true about us and the world. Hindus are not required to believe anything that does not make sense and can never be verified. There is complete freedom.
Yes, most Hindus believe in rebirth, which makes sense.
Most believe in an all-pervading Brahman (other names are in use). All-pervading means of course that is also in humans.
Most also believe that this Divine Essence can be experienced in oneself, if the person purifies herself by certain disciplines coupled with devotion.
This belief is verifiable. It is not blind. There were many Rishis who realized their oneness with Brahman.
In Christianity, too, there were mystics who experienced oneness with the Divine like Meister Eckhart for example. Sadly, he was excommunicated by the Church. Why is the Church resisting scientific insight that there is some mystery essence in everything? And why is it difficult to accept that in the long, long history of humanity, there were several (not only one) outstanding personalities who showed the way to the truth.
Holy Father, I request you in all sincerity to be such an outstanding personality who guides his followers on a path of expansion, and does not straight-jacket them into an unbelievable belief system, which among others demands converting Hindus to Christianity. Your Holiness is venerated as the representative of the Highest Power in this universe by over a billion of Catholics. Many of your predecessors were not worthy of this veneration. Utmost truthfulness and integrity are required. Calculations about worldly power must not come in the way. The Catholic Church surely would benefit, not lose out, if it honors Truth and gives up its claim that there is no salvation outside the Church. Truth cannot be cheated; neither can it be contained in a book. Truth is what we basically are. Hindus, whose religion is universal and all-encompassing, respect diverse traditions. They are one of the most cultured, gentle and peace-loving people on earth who live and let live, unless greatly provoked.
Holy Father, if you are serious about respecting other religions, the claim of exclusiveness must be scrapped and Hindus who have given to the world a deep philosophy and a great culture, must be respected. Many of us look forward to hearing truly good news from the Catholic Church under your stewardship. The main issue that plagues the Church is not whether women should be priests or whether divorcees can take Holy Communion .The main issue is the unfounded claim of exclusiveness regarding ‘salvation’. It divides humanity into us who are right and saved, versus them who are wrong and damned. Kindly drop this harmful claim and make your Pontificate truly memorable and beneficial for all humanity.
Yours Sincerely
Maria Wirth
Posted as registered letter to Pope Francis on 10th December 2013 from Puducherry, India
140 Comments
A Commendable Job done by you mam. Am highly impressed by this bold attempt of yours.!! I could never think of writing such an open letter to Pope Francis directly, in an attempt to enlighten him, that India is the place which gave birth to many religions, India is the place that teach spirituality. This humble attempt made by you mean so much to Indians, the people those who are generally ignorant about the issues regarding religions and spirituality, those who believe whatsoever one preaches them.
Spirituality is genetic to Indians.!!
Moreover mam, if one actually makes a sincere attempt at searching for the truth oneself, one can surely see for oneself which religion talks about spirituality. Ram Krishna Paramhans, converted to Christianity, could not be satisfied, converted to Islam, could get no spirituality, and at last came back to the science he earlier left, Hinduism. Found every thing, convinced himself, and then became a guru, and his student became.. Swami Vivekanada.!!
Moreover, there is already a controversy about the lost years of Jesus Christ were spent in India educating himself. There is a theory that connects Him to Kashmir, and also, to Puri in Odisha where they say, that Jesus was once at conflict with the local God-Men (Brahmans/Pundits) for preaching the spirituality to lower caste people.!! People here in India called him Isamasi. I dont feel, that many in the west knows Him with this name.!!
”
.. However, I sense (wrongly maybe) that it is a plea for other religions to respect Christianity, rather than a commitment by the Church to respect other religions…
…Your Holiness is aware that both, Christianity and Islam, claim to be the only true religion and their God, respectively Allah alone is true. Both religions further hold that all people on earth have to accept this claim and join their particular religion to be saved and reach heaven or paradise. Both give a serious warning to those who don’t join: they will land up eternally in hell. These claims of exclusiveness are made without any evidence whatsoever, apart from the fact that the claims contradict each other, as both cannot be true….
”
I personally feel, that these religions fit more perfectly in the mould of some management organisation’s rather than a knowledge sphere preaching spirituality. These religions teach subjects like Organisational Behaviour, Management, Networking, but not spirituality.
Anyways, coming back your letter mam, I must say, that I would be looking forward to Pope Francis ‘ reply, whether favourable or unfavourable, enlightened or still caught in the web of Maya.!!
||OM||
Reblogged this on Varun Goyal and commented:
Crusade by Ms. Maria Wirth, enlightened soul, to make this world a better place to live.!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=UNRLKDLJnX0
My namesake always gives voice to my own thoughts. How I wished Pope read this letter and gave a response. Although unfortunately I am afraid his last Exhortation goes in the same line of evangelisation which Church cannot help but do, because it is in the very core of the religion. There is a simple change of strategy: converting instead of through the harsh imposition, by “sharing the joy of Jesús”. But in any case, the Church continues exhorting their flock to convert others, the wrong ones. Hope is the last to die, dear Maria, and I also dream of a change. But meanwhile I´d rather encourage hindus to learn more about our own religion and why it is not worthy to leave a mature highly developed philosophy for a childish religion.
what a write up. I do not know what to say. Maybe I should say she Maria is too good. People like her should be head of religious organisations. Totally fair, unbiased who can see from all sides. Open minded.
Dear Maria,
Each letter by you is an eye opener. I really appreciate your beliefs and interpretations. As you have written rightly about multi Gods in Hindustan , there are they say 33crore Gods. But when this figure was arrived at perhaps more than a millennium before , the total population in the known world was estimated to be around that . So the wise sages of India considered each man to be a God. Not that we – the Hindus believed there are 33 crore divine Gods.
Thanks and regards?
Sent from my iPad
Dear Maria ,
The clarity and the conviction with which you have written the articles in your blog, reflect a great sense of enlightenment within you. Your articles have certainly instilled a great sense of pride and strengthened my identity as a Hindu.
Thank you so much.
Prashanth
What an eye opener? God bless. I don’t think Pope will reply to this. Lets see the contents in case he decides to reply.
Matha Maria , The every word of yours are every thoughts of sensible Hindus , we must be take this conversion issue in the top level itself , that who propagates from Rome or wealthier fundamentalist. You did the great great job , I think every sensible Hindu must be thankful to you, May the God give you much more energy and courage to sustain this eternal truth of Sanathana Dharma.
In one of her many letters to the Vatican she wrote, “In my soul, I can’t tell you how dark it is, how painful, how terrible it is, I feel like refusing god.” Mother Theresa
The truth is the pope isn’t better off.
Great sensible argument. Conversions mainly happen by exploiting the poverty and a lack of proper support to the poor people by the government ,who live in the fringes of india.Some North Eastern states of india has already undergone complete conversion due to the activities by evangelical churches. Their ancestral cultures are torn apart. It requires an unprecedented collective effort to convey people of the fallacy that is going on.Why destroy so many rich cultures in the name of saving souls.we can help poor without destroying the fabric of their rich heritage.
Reply from an Informed catholic:
Dear Maria,
Firstly, It is not an open letter if it is actually addressed to a particular person.So the Title itself is self contradictory.
If you would really like to communicate to the Pope I would recommend contacting the Papal Nuncio to India Archbishop Salvatore Pennaccio.
I have given the contact details here:
Apostolic Nunciature, 50-C Niti Marg,Chanakyapuri, New Delhi 110 021
Tel. 011- 42492300, Fax. 011 – 26874286
Email: nuntius@apostolicnunciatureindia.com
Website: http://www.apostolicnunciature.com
Secondly, you seem to be completely ignorant of the fact that the Pope Paul made an open declaration of the relationship between Hindus and Catholics as early as 1932.I will publish the reformed 1965 Vatican 2 council declaration here for your kind perusal:
“Thus in Hinduism, men contemplate the divine mystery and express it through an inexhaustible abundance of myths and through searching philosophical inquiry. They seek freedom from the anguish of our human condition either through ascetical practices or profound meditation or a flight to God with love and trust. Again, Buddhism, in its various forms, realizes the radical insufficiency of this changeable world; it teaches a way by which men, in a devout and confident spirit, may be able either to acquire the state of perfect liberation, or attain, by their own efforts or through higher help, supreme illumination. Likewise, other religions found everywhere try to counter the restlessness of the human heart, each in its own manner, by proposing “ways,” comprising teachings, rules of life, and sacred rites. The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions.”
-DECLARATION ON
THE RELATION OF THE CHURCH TO NON-CHRISTIAN RELIGIONS
NOSTRA AETATE
PROCLAIMED BY HIS HOLINESS
POPE PAUL VI
I will even provide a link for the full document, and the real views of Catholic Christians on other religions:
http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-
ii_decl_19651028_nostra-aetate_en.html
This should explain why Europeans you met in Germany had those views.
I recommend you google for Nostra Aetate and to choose the first link if this link should not work for any reason.
Thirdy, you seem completely oblivious to the fact that catholic missionaries are the only source of education, food and healthcare in vast parts of India.With over 50% of our country below the poverty line these missionaries provide healthcare completely free of cost, when our own doctors are clamoring to go abroad.
It is amusing how a few urban upper-caste elites make blanket declarations like”Hindu India does not need Christian Charity”, and think they can condemn so many people to poverty, when we have no means of replacing the work that these charities do.who is going to do that?Our corrupt govenrment?
Catholic run Convent schools have mainly Hindu and Muslim children, who retain their faith even after 12 years of schooling in those institutions.I recommend you visit any Salesian school and see this for yourself.
If we were really hell bent on conversion, why would the Pope openly declare that
“She(the catholic church) regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men. “?
and why is it that only 1.22% of the country is catholic even after 300 years of British rule(UK is actually angilcan protestant, not even related to the Pope)
Lastly,Christians have lived in India, and have co-existed with Hindus for over 1500 years.Even Ishwar Sharan, an anti-christian ‘historian’ admits that there is evidence that christian Nasranis were there in Kerala in the 2nd century itself.I will give the link here:
http://ishwarsharan.wordpress.com/
“The Christian community in South India was founded by a merchant called Knai Thoma or Thomas of Cana in 345 AD—a name which readily explains the Thomas legend. He led four hundred refugees who fled persecution in Persia and were given asylum by the Hindu authorities.”
In light of all this, it should become clear that it is not our intention to spread falsehood, but is peaceful co-existence.We are Indians as well, and while some ‘christians’ may have forced this conversion in the early stages, the Syrio-Malabar and Syrio-Melankara rites are declared as unique and special from the Latin rite of the Portuguese.
We were there before the portuguese and are different from them.
I humbly request you to dig and see the facts for yourself and see things more holistically before mocking the Pope this way.
If you have any doubts about the catholic faith, and the views we have on certain things or have complaints about anything, including the actions of missionaries, I recomend you to contact the address I have given or to complain to relevant authorities rather than spreading misinformation about a major world religion.
I am willing to discuss certain aspects of the faith too, I am an engineering student , and hence can only reply when free.
Thank you!…:)
Joseph Hubert
a concerned catholic
The indian govt is hand in glove with the missionaries. All they have to do is pass a law that conversion through incentives is illegal. But that is the agenda of the uneducated lying to parliament italian bitch.
Hi Maria,
The religion is faith and duty in life is ‘Dharma’ of life.
Both, Christianity and Islam, claim to be the only true religion and their God, respectively Allah alone is true. Both religions further hold that all people on earth have to accept this claim and join their particular religion to be saved and reach heaven or paradise.
The religions including Hindu are moving round the salvation through one God or many Gods. The main issue is the unfounded claim of exclusiveness regarding ‘salvation’ The Life is eternal and the rebirth or reincarnation is absolute truth to face the deeds of present life ‘as you sow, so you reap’
The creation has evolved from zero to infinite nature within sky, he is hidden within us. It has evolved into infinity, and its shape is like stammering lips of hymn chanter.
The lip shaped space enclosed in the body is the seat of vital energy, and connects the individual to the infinite sky beyond time and space above duality. It is the source of super natural powers hidden within the human body.
It has been searched scientifically to prove its seat in the body, and process of awakening the hidden source to acquire super natural powers. It has been described as hidden serpent power lying at the base of sitting, just like a concentric circular dormant rope. When it is awakened, it ascends towards the brain like a serpent hood moving upward with flickering tongue in the air.
The space at the base is vital source of life consciousness. It appears with birth and disappears with death.
Dear Mr Joseph Hubert,
Let us get few facts right. The Catholic adheres to Nicene creed. For a Christian, there is no salvation outside the Church. Are you denying this fact, Sir? Please read Rajiv Malhotra’s book ” Breaking India”. It clearly outlines with SOLID REFERENCES to various methods used by the Christian clergy, Catholics included, in converting the poor and uneducated Hindus to Christianity. Catholics should preach what they DECLARE. Your response to Madam Maria Wirth is nothing but” Christian Taqiyya”. All these heart warming Christian kindness comes always with strings ( read conversion) attached. Period.
Mr Hubert:
First of all, apologies for my long response, but I think it is necessary.
I understand your feelings as a Catholic, and your need to defend what you think it is fair. But with due respects, let me tell you some things from another defender of justice, a staunch Hindu, me, of catholic background (born in a catholic country), whose duty is also to try to defend Dharma, which is simply what Maria has done here so beautifully. This is not a mock of the Pope at all, but honestly, many times I wonder if the Vatican itself is not mocking at the whole humanity by its attitude and what is worse, by its disrespectful deeds!.
I´m responding the points about which I have something to say. The rest, I don´t know the issue deep enough because I don´t live in India.
1 FYI : “open letter”
noun
a letter, often of protest or criticism, addressed to a specific person, but intended to be brought to public attention.
SOURCE: dictionary.com
In any case, she has also sent it by post to the Pope.
2 “ Real views of Catholic Christians on other religions” you say? Let me tell you the “real views of the Catholic Church”:
a) Are you not aware of the statements embodied in Dominus Iesus, another declaration from the Vatican itself, of year 2000 ?.
Let me highlight for you some of the “pearls”: http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_20000806_dominus-iesus_en.html :
– For this reason, the distinction between theological faith and belief in the other religions, must be firmly held. If faith is the acceptance in grace of revealed truth, which makes it possible to penetrate the mystery in a way that allows us to understand it coherently,21 then belief, in the other religions, is that sum of experience and thought that constitutes the human treasury of wisdom and religious aspiration, which man in his search for truth has conceived and acted upon in his relationship to God and the Absolute.22
This distinction is not always borne in mind in current theological reflection. Thus, theological faith (the acceptance of the truth revealed by the One and Triune God) is often identified with belief in other religions, which is religious experience still in search of the absolute truth and still lacking assent to God who reveals himself. This is one of the reasons why the differences between Christianity and the other religions tend to be reduced at times to the point of disappearance.
– Nevertheless, God, who desires to call all peoples to himself in Christ and to communicate to them the fullness of his revelation and love, does not fail to make himself present in many ways, not only to individuals, but also to entire peoples through their spiritual riches, of which their religions are the main and essential expression even when they contain ˜gaps, insufficiencies and errors”.27 Therefore, the sacred books of other religions, which in actual fact direct and nourish the existence of their followers, receive from the mystery of Christ the elements of goodness and grace which they contain.
– The Church’s Magisterium, faithful to divine revelation, reasserts that Jesus Christ is the mediator and the universal redeemer. (…)The Second Vatican Council has recalled to the consciousness of the Church’s faith this fundamental truth. In presenting the Father’s salvific plan for all humanity, the Council closely links the mystery of Christ from its very beginnings with that of the Spirit.
– It must therefore be firmly believed as a truth of Catholic faith that the universal salvific will of the One and Triune God is offered and accomplished once for all in the mystery of the incarnation, death, and resurrection of the Son of God.
Bearing in mind this article of faith, theology today, in its reflection on the existence of other religious experiences and on their meaning in God’s salvific plan, (…)those solutions that propose a salvific action of God beyond the unique mediation of Christ would be contrary to Christian and Catholic faith.
– Indeed, the Church, guided by charity and respect for freedom,98 must be primarily committed to proclaiming to all people the truth definitively revealed by the Lord, and to announcing the necessity of conversion to Jesus Christ and of adherence to the Church through Baptism and the other sacraments, in order to participate fully in communion with God, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Thus, the certainty of the universal salvific will of God does not diminish, but rather increases the duty and urgency of the proclamation of salvation and of conversion to the Lord Jesus Christ.
– In treating the question of the true religion, the Fathers of the Second Vatican Council taught: We believe that this one true religion continues to exist in the Catholic and Apostolic Church, to which the Lord Jesus entrusted the task of spreading it among all people. Thus, he said to the Apostles: ˜Go therefore and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you’ (Mt 28: 19-20). Especially in those things that concern God and his Church, all persons are required to seek the truth, and when they come to know it, to embrace it and hold fast to it.
b) Just in case, the “real views on other religions” are not clear yet, the Pope in his last exhortation “EVANGELII GAUDIUM”, as recent as of last 24th of november, states, reitarating:
– cannot forget that evangelization is first and foremost about preaching the Gospel to those who do not know Jesus Christ or who have always rejected him. Many of these are quietly seeking God, led by a yearning to see his face, even in countries of ancient Christian tradition. All of them have a right to receive the Gospel. Christians have the duty to proclaim the Gospel without excluding anyone. Instead of seeming to impose new obligations, they should appear as people who wish to share their joy, who point to a horizon of beauty and who invite others to a delicious banquet. It is not by proselytizing that the Church grows, but “by attraction”.
Doesn´t this sound, even for a deaf person, as simply a clear “change of strategy”?
You can find it in this link: http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/francesco/apost_exhortations/documents/papa-francesco_esortazione-ap_20131124_evangelii-gaudium_en.html#THE_NEW_EVANGELIZATION_FOR_THE_TRANSMISSION_OF_THE_FAITH
Do you know what? For me a hindu with previous catholic background by birth, this intolerant, supremacist and disrespecful attitude of the Church towards the others´ religions I would say is even scary for me. More scary if you know what this attitude has brought along the history. Another link but with a warning for you: it may cause a crisis of faith in you, so if you are not ready for that, don´t read about the numerous attrocities the Church has done in the name of “the only true religion”, the “mission” and “Jesus”, exactly what Maria wants to make the readers aware through her open letter.
http://freetruth.50webs.org/A1.htm#monkmob
3) As far as I know, most of the hindu indians I know who had gone to catholic schools in India, remain hindu almost only namely. They had been uprooted from their own pride as hindus, and imbibed in them a sort of colonial mindset in which they don´t feel comfortable within themselves and their own skin as much as they could.
Till the Church doesn´t renounce to claim itself to be the “only COMPLETE truth”, till she renounces to that exclusivity claim, we dharmic people will have to keep defending ourselves and Dharma from the Church´s violent attack that the conversions mean. Till the Church, as Mr. Rajiv Malhotra says, doesn´t give “full respect” to other faiths, what he calls “mutual respect”, and not mere “tolerance” to them, we´ll have to keep defending ourselves from a, I would say, dishonest advancement that the Church does with us and other dharmic religions: as he explains clearly, saying that you “tolerate” somebody is a sheer lack of respect in itself. And that is the biggest concession you can get from the Church in any interfaith dialogue. Would you like, as Mr. Malhotra says, that your wife someday tells you “I tolerate you”?. We all people deserve a minimum: and that minimum should be not less than this concept of “mutual respect”. Do you think that this is possible to get when in the core of the catholicism the MORAL DUTY IS TO CONVERT?
P.S.: Nothing of the written here is intented to be personal against you, as you may realise. But you only as the voice that has raised in the name of catholics. No mean to offend you at all. Simply trying to defend the truth.
Thank you
Maria Lozano
A concerned Hindu
I feel the major work has already been done by Mr. Rajiv Malhotra. He has written two books.
1. Being Different
2. Breaking India
Both are the books OF INDIA, BY INDIA, FOR INDIA. They are available on flipkart. These books are a must read for the people concerned with the actual history of the nation and the latest happening regarding the religion Hinduism.
Must reads.
Dear brother Joseph,
Only i can enlighten with the quote of Sir Desmond Mpilo Tutu , I am sure you are aware of it… but I will remind to you below ,
” When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said ‘Let us pray.’ We closed our eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land.”
Desmond Tutu
Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/d/desmond_tutu.html#ymy1vBsHzU5jDWvz.99.
If you are belong to Indian DNA , please be awakened like Sir Desmond Tutu,
Dear brother Joseph,
Only i can enlighten you with the quote of Sir Desmond Mpilo Tutu , I am sure you are aware of it… but still I will remind to you below ,
” When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said ‘Let us pray.’ We closed our eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land.”
Desmond Tutu
Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/d/desmond_tutu.html#ymy1vBsHzU5jDWvz.99.
If you are belong to Indian DNA , please be awakened like Sir Desmond Tutu,
Wonderful site!: See this one: “God is not upset that Gandhi was not a Christian, because God is not a Christian! All of God’s children and their different faiths help us to realize the immensity of God”
Desmond Tutu
Dear Maria,
Thank you for sharing your letter with us. You wrote it very sweetly, wisely and logically.
Any reply from Mr.Pope..!!! ?
there is no need for a verbal reply by the Pope. action is necessary, a declaration that the dogma ‘No salvation outside the Church’ is withdrawn and conversion activities stopped…
the facts mentioned in the letter need to be known widely and pressure on the Pope to drop those ridiculous claims and to truly respect Hindu Dharma should build up.
Dear Goyalji, We hindus must look into how effectively we can develop the shield to resist the conversion activities. Respected Pope may or may not consider the request of Hindus.
Dear Ms.Maria
I am an Indian christian and proud of being a part of Indian christian heritage. Without doubt I can say that the spiritual experiences I have as a follower of christ are true. If you can say that the christians in west have renounced their faith, the same thing had happened during the time of Jesus when many turned away from him on hearing that the preachings are hard to bear. I am not sure whether you know or not that there are many christians in India who are strong in faith ande there are volumes of testimonies and experiences. Do you mean to say that all of us christians are having begging bowls to expect something always from the west. Every religion claims to have an universality not just christianity, if hinduism is geniunely universal and believe in the concept of every one as a born hindu then it must not worry about people who are christians. Do you mean to say that the teachings of christ make one a sub human being or will it make him lose his values. Being a westerner you have embraced hinduism and being an easterner people like me have embraced an eastern belief which is wrongly portrayed as a western religion. If Hinduism believes that all paths lead to salvation it need not worry about christianity which says that there is no salvation outside the christian beliefs, it is for the individuals to decide. There are certain school of thoughts within hinduism that negates each other. Last but one comment, that pope is not the sole authority of christianity.
Many right wing thinkers in India always strive to equate patriotism with religion and stamp the minorities as being unpatriotic. There are many Indians who are (non christians) citizens of western countries and are loyal to their country of adoption, whereas here the so called right wingers propagate the fact that one has to be a Hindu to become a loyal citizen. Strange, we as christians live in this country and are loyal here alone ,not to vatican or london. It is also not right to say that christanity makes you to shed your identity as an Indian. Simply refusing to worship or adore Hindu belief systems will not make one less Indian.
A good reason is that during the First World war, personnel from the Indian subcontinent, largely Hindus but others too, fought to defend liberty for humanity. Debated in the UK parliament
http://www.theyworkforyou.com/lords/?id=2013-12-18a.1314.3
Well written and I am totally with you on letting people practice the belief they want without others demeaning their faith! I have posted a link to this letter in my blog post http://peeekaaabooo.blogspot.com/2014/01/beliefs.html?m=1
[…] Source: Maria Wirth Blog […]
Dear Maria,
I really like your Open Letter to pope Francis, in your heartfull way to speak.
….. but what´s worth ?
The judeo-christian God and Allah are the same entities, the vedic tradition is referring as Asura-gods,…the dark and mighty dark gods….in the modern research-communities known as “Reptilians from SIRIUS / ORION, which are looking upon Humankind as a prey…to slaughter and eat.
Look at these monotheistic religions, which are better described as “mind-infections”,…look at the fruits of their devotional “enterprises”…look at the international banksters, who are the real “princes of the dark judeo-christian god”.
These are the selfestablished shepherd`s -dogs…surrounding the flock of sheeps and always greedy in feathering their nest.
To whom did you wrote your letter ?
To the people who are starting to awake from their century-long sleep!
Thank you from my heart…beating in Germany
Namaste
Bernhard
I wish this was a petition to the respected Holy Father so that millions of like minded could have signed and stood behind you.
Jaisriram.If Pope is dare to accept the facts n direct accodingly to their missionaries there will be certainly cordial atmosphere between Hindus n Christians.Otherwise not.
I think that the interpretations made on Christianity and Islam are basically wrong. It would be better to understand this way. Religion is True Religion be it Hinduism, Christianity, Islam or any other Religion. Joining a Religion means to be religious either as a Christian or Muslim or any other, rather than not belonging to one. In which case one will be an Atheist which is the dangerous thing and is likely lead to Hell. Church means and includes any place of Worship like Mosque and Temple. Jesus or Allah is only a name for the eternal being. He has thousands of names. I think this is what all religions mean and it is only the interpretations going wrong catching on to names leaving the essence leading to Fanaticism.
We discuss religion as if it were the reason for our existence. There’s no denying that missionaries are active and conversion to Christianity is rampant. The low hanging fruit for them is the rather huge section of our Indian population that will trade its beliefs and faith for the sake of survival; and let’s be honest – that choice is an easy one to make. What that means is that religion comes second to survival, and which is where it belongs. People like you and me have this compelling need to justify the acts of our religion because our basic needs are met – we survive just fine. And speaking for our religion with pseudo-intellectualism is just one of those things we have to do to show our religion is the superior one, if not the more tolerant one.
While the act of providing for the poor is noble, the intent and philosophy of spreading religion in lieu of it is certainly not. And which is why the letter has rightly been addressed to the Pope, he who represents the religion. A shift in ideology is much needed across religions.
Disclaimer – I’m not an atheist. I’ m a proud Hindu, and a very tolerant one with respect and regard for EVERY religion.
M.K.Gandhi said “if anyone can prove to me that any religion is better than Hinduism ,I will be the first to convert to it and will try my best to convert all Hindus (indians) to it.”
Joseph, you are the one who is ignorant of what the Pope said.
It is hypocritical to say “The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions” and to what end, when Christ said “I am the way, the truth and the life and no one comes to the father but through me.”
Rajan Kumar, it is not “better” we are looking for, but the truth where religion is in harmony with reasoning, science and inconfirmity with natural laws.
“But there is another prejudice which is cherished by many scholars evidently under the impression of its being a well-recognized scientific doctrine. It is that in the ruder stages of civilization, when the laws of nature are little known and but little understood, when mankind has not enough of the experience of the world, strict methods of correct reasoning are very seldom observed.” Swami Dayanand
Joseph,
Universality does not mean that everyone is a born Hindu. It means that we all are truly made of the same (extraordinary, divine) stuff, as it were, and we don’t need to undergo a ritual to ‘belong’ to those who are saved. The problem I see with Christianity and Islam is that they are a mix of good and bad aspects. Good is the reverence for a creator/ cause of us and the universe, further rules for good living (which, however, conscience also provides and sometimes even better, as those rules often induce guilt in children), and then the bad, which is “we alone are right, God loves only us’, “others go to hell, God has condemned them”. It is not difficult to see that the resulting mind-set is harmful for humankind. If not convinced, just look at history, open minded, or look around in today’s world.
My salute to maria Wirth.
Madhu, if your faith can be demeaned, it is weak and therefore has nothing to do with the one true God of the universe. I was born in the West (South America) and never went to India, the cradle of all civilization, but yet I have made the effort required to know that all the religions in the world are false, except one. It means, that you don’t have to be born in India to know the truth, but again if you are from India you have an advantage over anyone else on this planet.
Its natural that the Muslims and Christians missionaries are worried because existence of their religion depends only with their followers. So they are converting people for their existence. but Hinduism is law of nature. . you can’t see any procedures to be a Hindu or to convert to Hinduism.
It’s difficult to find knowledgeable people on
this topic, but you seem like you know what you’re talking
about! Thanks
beautifully explained …….. especially the words used “They are one of the most cultured, gentle and peace-loving people on earth who live and let live, unless greatly provoked.”….
You know madam..i rarely find people from Christianity n Islam writing something like this.This is d most mature n true matter that i have come across. Iam a Hindu who studied in a convent n was talked to abt conversion by d nun’s at tht time only because they got to know we r having financial issues.They even had asked us if wd knew poorer people n they can preach n convert them.They even askdd me when i would want to join a convent.When you love your religion you will automatically respect other religions.If you dont respect other religions u become a fanatic of ur own religion n tht is not good.The christians in Kerala tamil nadu andhra give them a look n they sure look like Indians n i can say 100% these were all converts .people whose ancestors were converted by Christians who cams in from the west.all said n done they follow Christianity n its their belief now.As long as they don’t try to convert from now on.
Dear Maria,
Please receive the blessings of the Supreme lord Krishna.
This is the best article and blog that i ever red. Thanks for showing the whole world how rich the INDIAN culture is.Unfortunately the whole world is going in different direction.Hope many people will read your articles and understand the meaning.
I request all others to spread awareness about this blog as much as possible.
I am a converted Christian from India. Not from so called ‘high caste’. Much needed medical help and education came from Christians and not from anybody else. Maria Wirth has done in-depth study of Hindu literature. In all fairness, he should study the Bible also with a real interest to know the truth there. If he does that he would not think Christians are intolerant. Whatever they do, they do out of love. Who would not tell others if what they have got is real and true ? If you got something from a shop which is good and economical, you definitely tell your friend whom you care for. You don’t do that if what you got is no big deal or if you don’t care for your friend.
Sir please learn abt Sri Ramakrishna Paramahamsa. He was one of the rarest personalities who Could practice all the different pathways of sanatana dharma:sakta, vaishnava, advaita etc. While it took 40 years for his guru to experience brahmam ,sri ramakrishna could do it in 3 days. But he wanted diversity. He was a person who proved that all religions lead to Lord. Not that your intentions are bad , it could be a misconception. Read the Gospel of sri ramakrishna paramahamsa.
Jaisriram.As they talk about respectable co-existence of religions will happen only when christian missionaries stop dirty,ugly,heinous,cruel convertions.
Akhilpattamatta,
I may be wrong when I say that Shri Ramakrishna converted to other religions..!! Actually, I intended to convey that he mastered the teachings of Islam, Christianity and other religions and only then he became critic to them. Buddhism and Jainism too. Only later, when he properly convinced himself about which science really discusses true GOD, when he proved to himself that Spirituality has some meaning, only then he started preaching all these things.!! I meant that he understood Islam Christianity and even then, he did what he did. I am an ardent follower of Ramakrishan Ashram.
[…] December 11, 2013 · by mariawirthblog · in Uncategorized · 49 Comments […]
brother u replied correctly. I agree with u. People in our country used to take everything in wrong unbdestanding only. I am a christion and I have not seen any one in my life that church is converting any body to christion by presure or by giving money. When pope talk abt religious freedum that does mean that an individual have the right to choose his religion and its up to him which religion he choses. GOD has certainly revealed the truth and its upto humans to decide. The consequences are also revealed upon. I see the letter from Maria as politically inspired only. Christinity does not say that by force any one can become chriatian in fact no one is born christion untill he take baptism and accept Jesus in his life by his own. In fact christian are being persecuted all over world including India and thats why religious freedom is required. I m not a catholic but I am a Christian. I hv been raised between all hindu families in our neighbourhoods. So I know abt other religion also. It would be nice if the author of this letter send letter to hindu extrimists.
Vijay, It is upto u to accept or not to accept what Jesus said. No body is forcing you to accept. But if some one is accepting it I dont think any one else has any right to interfere in his beliefe. Its churches responsibility to tell people abt Jesus Christ. What is wrong in it? Christians do not tell any wrong things abt hindus but they tell abt GOD and Jesus which is an individuals right.
Telling abt GOD and Jesus is one’s right and responsbility as salvation is for every one. Its upto individual to accept it or not. I am a Christian. I took birth in a christian family but no one is born christian untill he/she truely acepts GOD and Jesus(by all his heart and not by force). I hv been raised between all hindu families neighboring. So I know all abt hinduism. Its an indiviuals responsbility also to know the true GOD.
Good day! Would you mind if I share your blog with my twitter group?
There’s a lot of folks that I think would really enjoy your content.
Please let me know. Thank you
of course, please feel free to share the articles on the blog. i am happy when the thoughts go around…
Om Tat Sat
Attempt at proselytization with the lure of material resources or coercion is wrong and unacceptable. Jesus Christ did not direct his followers to do this. But he did say go out and baptize people in the name of the father, the son and the holy spirit. Any follower worth his salt cannot deny this. In fact the apostles of Christ lost their lives trying to spread his word (St Thomas in India).
I think respect for other religions is important. But at the same time people have a right to know and choose. If the caste system in India had treated everyone with equality, I can assure you that there wouldn’t be many conversions. As long as conversion makes a person a better human being it is good. If it makes him want to go out and punish people for not believing, then there is a problem with the individual most probably and not the religion.
People here are taking about man made religion and not about spirituality itself. Look as Ani is pointing out, Christ wanted his followers to go out and preach the truth and Christians cannot ignore that. Period. Can India dent the missionary help that India has received in education, health care …etc? How many people would have hugged the lepers of Calcutta? If you want unconditional service without the strings attached?…it is not fair! When people act out of love and faith the recipient respects the service and wants to know more about the person rendering the service. It is natural. I am a Indian catholic and haven’t observed any forced conversions!
The fact that Indian Christians are converted doesn’t carry weight. Who isn’t? Do you mean to say Hinduism came into existence with the evolution of man? Jesus spread the message of Love even for your enemies and that is a news no one should be afraid of. Be worried about Christians not Christianity!
Thanks for the article.
Please have a look at this also.
http://www.indiafacts.co.in/pope-francis-holy-snake-oil-salesman/#.VFTxHbRBwtI
We (Indians/Hindu people) are the FOUNDERS; they are the FOLLOWERS. But due to IMPERIALISM and years of foreign rule over India, this vital fact has been forgotten and followers are claiming to be founders.
How can Photocopy become Original copy? Original copy will always be original and photocopy would always be photocopy. Can both ever match?
Everything starts from the Vedas. The Ved is the ORIGINAL COPY of all the religions Sir. Come to the eternal religion of the Holy Vedas and find meaning of yourself. All the three Palestinian religions are based on the fundamental principles as laid down by the Vedas. Hari Om.
Dear Maria,
I recently came across your excellent blog. You may be interested in this article – it reinforces your point. For a humane person like Pope Francis to take the proactive step of canonizing someone responsible for the destruction of Native American culture is problematic. Passive recognition that some historical wrongs cannot be righted is one thing, but pro-active furtherance of the attitudes that led to the destruction in the first place suggests that something more fundamental is at play…
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/22/us/to-some-indians-in-california-father-serra-is-far-from-a-saint.html
Sister , Can your church preach at arabian countries where jesus born and escaped gallows and fortunately he survived in India at Kashmir . As a jew Jesus taken Buddism and Vedic knowledge and try to Liberate Arabian Peninsula from the clutches of Romans.
What? First the noble White race gives the gift of computers, internet and all manner of information technology to these backward natives and now these primitives apes show their gratitude by turning around and telling them what to do? Brute savages.
That’s very common misconception.misconception. Sri Ramakrishna practised 99.99% hinduism throughout his life,and 0.001% other religions that too because he is a hindu.
Since the independence of India, some people claiming to be the followers of Sri Ramkrishna Paramhansadev (Indian Hindu saint, philosopher and a godly figure lived in nineteenth century), are propagating that by the doctrine ‘all religions are only different paths to the same God’ (that is Jata mat tata path). Sri Ramkrishna endorsed all religions, including Christianity and Islam, as paths to God. But in the first chapter of the twenty fifth part of second volume of Ramkrishna Paramhansa (speeches of Sri Ramkrishna) compiled by Sri Mahendra and published by the Ramkrishna Mission, it is clearly mentioned that on 26th September, 1884 Sri Vijaykrishna Goswami raised a question to Sri Ramkrishna at the “Brahma Samaj Mandir” of Calcutta that whether the worship of shapeless concept of God is superior to Idol worship. In that context Sri Ramkrishna told that idol worship and shapeless concept of God or monotheism and polytheism all had their values and were different paths to God. Based on that comment the above-mentioned theory of “Jata mat tata path” was laid down. In his several discourses on different occasions Sri Ramkrishna recognized the different methods of worship developed in India from the same Vedic philosophy of tolerance but not the aggressive theologies of the foreign invaders.
Though on one or two occasions Sri Ramkrishna mentioned about Islam and Christianity but he did not actually equate them with the Hindu Philosophy. This will be crystal-clear from his following statement. “Only Hindu religion is the eternal religion. The newer religions you see around you were created at per God’s will and will be abolished by God’s will, but will not last long. So I say salute TO ALL. But Hindu religion existed since eternity and will continue to exist forever”. [Ramkrishna Kathamrita, Chapter 3, Vol. 2, compiled by Mahendra Gupta]
The above and many other discourse of Sri Ramkrishna clearly indicate that he never equated Hindu religion with others and he always used to identify himself as a Hindu.
Sri ramakrishna says-“Only Hindu religion is the eternal religion. The newer religions you see around you were created at per God’s will and will be abolished by God’s will, but will not last long. So I say salute TO ALL. But Hindu religion existed since eternity and will continue to exist forever”. [Ramkrishna Kathamrita, Chapter 3, Vol. 2, compiled by Mahendra Gupta]”
He actually meant to say that Islam is created out of the will of god and will be destroyed by the will of the god only.
Again, the vast majority of Hindu perverts to
Islam and Christianity are perverts by the sword,
or the descendants of these. (5.233
In India the Mohammadens were the first who
ever took the sword. (5.197)
* * * * * *
Again, the vast majority of Hindu perverts to
Islam and Christianity are perverts by the sword,
or the descendants of these. (5.233)
Swami Vivekananda
Since the independence of India, some people claiming to be the followers of Sri Ramkrishna Paramhansadev (Indian Hindu saint, philosopher and a godly figure lived in nineteenth century), are propagating that by the doctrine ‘all religions are only different paths to the same God’ (that is Jata mat tata path). Sri Ramkrishna endorsed all religions, including Christianity and Islam, as paths to God. But in the first chapter of the twenty fifth part of second volume of Ramkrishna Paramhansa (speeches of Sri Ramkrishna) compiled by Sri Mahendra and published by the Ramkrishna Mission, it is clearly mentioned that on 26th September, 1884 Sri Vijaykrishna Goswami raised a question to Sri Ramkrishna at the “Brahma Samaj Mandir” of Calcutta that whether the worship of shapeless concept of God is superior to Idol worship. In that context Sri Ramkrishna told that idol worship and shapeless concept of God or monotheism and polytheism all had their values and were different paths to God. Based on that comment the above-mentioned theory of “Jata mat tata path” was laid down. In his several discourses on different occasions Sri Ramkrishna recognized the different methods of worship developed in India from the same Vedic philosophy of tolerance but not the aggressive theologies of the foreign invaders.
Though on one or two occasions Sri Ramkrishna mentioned about Islam and Christianity but he did not actually equate them with the Hindu Philosophy. This will be crystal-clear from his following statement. “Only Hindu religion is the eternal religion. The newer religions you see around you were created at per God’s will and will be abolished by God’s will, but will not last long. So I say salute TO ALL. But Hindu religion existed since eternity and will continue to exist forever”. [Ramkrishna Kathamrita, Chapter 3, Vol. 2, compiled by Mahendra Gupta]
The above and many other discourse of Sri Ramkrishna clearly indicate that he never equated Hindu religion with others and he always used to identify himself as a Hindu.
Sri ramakrishna says-“Only Hindu religion is the eternal religion. The newer religions you see around you were created at per God’s will and will be abolished by God’s will, but will not last long. So I say salute TO ALL. But Hindu religion existed since eternity and will continue to exist forever”. [Ramkrishna Kathamrita, Chapter 3, Vol. 2, compiled by Mahendra Gupta]”
He actually meant to say that Islam is created out of the will of god and will be destroyed by the will of the god only.
“the horrible idea prevailing among some
Christians and Mohammedans that the heathens
are the lawful victims of their swords and all the
horrors that have followed and are following it
still”. (Complete Works-4.270)
Again, the vast majority of Hindu perverts to
Islam and Christianity are perverts by the sword,
or the descendants of these. (5.233
In India the Mohammadens were the first who
ever took the sword. (5.197)
* * * * * *
Again, the vast majority of Hindu perverts to
Islam and Christianity are perverts by the sword,
or the descendants of these. (5.233)
What real music we have lies in Kirtana and
Dhrupada: the rest has been spoiled by being
modulated according to the Islamic methods. The
Mohammadens took up the different Ragas and
Raginis after coming into India. But they put such a
stamp of their own colouring on the art of Tappa
songs that all the science in music was destroyed.
(5.362)
In India the Mohammadens were the first who
ever took the sword. (5.197)
You know that the Hindu religion never
persecutes. It is the land where all sects may live in
peace and amity. The Mohammadens brought
murder and slaughter in their train, but until their
arrival peace prevailed. (5.190)
It is here that Indians build temples for
Mohammedans and Christians; nowhere else. If
you go to other countries and ask Mohammedans
or people of other religions to build a temple for
you, see how they will help. They will instead try
to break down your temple and you too if they can.
(3.114)
Swami Vivekananda
Swami Vivekananda (V) : Of course, purification of converted Hindus has to be done. If that is not done, population of Hindus will go on reducing. Farishta, an ancient Muslim historian says that population of Hindus was 60 crores when Muslims first came to India. Today (in 1899), it is only 20 crores. Most of the conversions were made by Muslims or Christians on the strength of sword. Today’s converted Hindus are descendents of the earlier converted Hindus; therefore, it is not right to drive them away. Those, who got converted by choice, can also be taken back in Hindu Dharma, if they so desire. Hindus who converted to other religions due to oppression need not be asked to take atonement while taking them back in Hindu Dharma
Swami Vivekeanada speaking about what damage Christian missionaries have done to India, he says in a lecture reported in the Detroit Free Press (February 21, 1894):
“They come to my country and abuse my forefathers, my religion, and everything; they walk near a temple and say ‘you idolators, you will go to hell’, but they dare not do this to the Mohammedans of India, for the sword will be out but the Hindu is too mild.”
Swami Vivekeanada speaking about what damage Christian missionaries have done to India, he says in a lecture reported in the Detroit Free Press (February 21, 1894):
“They come to my country and abuse my forefathers, my religion, and everything; they walk near a temple and say ‘you idolators, you will go to hell’, but they dare not do this to the Mohammedans of India, for the sword will be out but the Hindu is too mild.”
Swami Vivekananda termed religious conversion as “religious perversion”
“This proselytization will mean no peace in the world. Conversions are harmful to India. If I had the power and could legislate I should certainly stop all proselytizing.”
“It pains me to have to say that the Christian missionaries as a body, with honorable exceptions, have actively supported a system which has impoverished, enervated and demoralized a people considered to be among the gentlest and most civilized on earth….”
Swami Vivekananda termed religious conversion as “religious perversion”
“This proselytization will mean no peace in the world. Conversions are harmful to India. If I had the power and could legislate I should certainly stop all proselytizing.”
“It pains me to have to say that the Christian missionaries as a body, with honorable exceptions, have actively supported a system which has impoverished, enervated and demoralized a people considered to be among the gentlest and most civilized on earth….”
There were on the boat, among other passengers, two Christian missionaries who, in the course of a heated discussion with the Swami, lost their tempers and savagely criticized the Hindu religion. The Swami walked to one of them, seized him by the collar, and said menacingly, ‘If you abuse my religion again, I will throw you overboard.’
‘Let me go, sir,’ the frightened missionary apologized; ‘I’ll never do it again.’
Later, in the course of a conversation with a disciple in Calcutta, he asked, ‘What would you do if someone insulted your mother?’ The disciple answered, ‘I would fall upon him, sir, and teach him a good lesson.’
‘Bravo!’ said the Swami. ‘Now, if you had the same positive feeling for your religion, your true mother, you could never see any Hindu brother converted to Christianity. Yet you see this occurring every day, and you are quite indifferent. Where is your faith? Where is your patriotism? Every day Christian missionaries abuse Hinduism to your face, and yet how many are there amongst you whose blood boils with righteous indignation and who will stand up in its defense?’
“I´d rather encourage hindus to learn more about our own religion and why it is not worthy to leave a mature highly developed philosophy for a childish religion.” when most of the Hindus, have no understanding of the high philosophy, they get entrapped by other philosophy. The onus is upon us(people like me) to ensure that we do explain the philosophy to other Hindus. The failure is ours. It’s not Christianity/Muslims win.
Mam Maria Wirth,
Hats of to you,
for thinking in the way the real human being thinks. “Way Of Life”
Reblogged this on Language is Modem….
Dear mari ji krishna incarhnates day in and day out in your heart and makes you say truth everytimeIt would be nice meeting a divine person lie you.Where you live presently
Dr Himanshu kumar
One of the most lucid and revealing presentations-truly unbiased and very fair. Wish there were many more such people!
Outside of the “Church”, we, the Illuminati, have always known that Paul embraced the temptations of Satan repudiated by Jesus and turned Christianity into an Empire through Charlemagne. For this, a Council was formed that cherry picked gospels suitable for the purpose and discarded the rest. This is why present day Christians cannot perform the miracles that Jesus’ original disciples could despite claiming to be following in Jesus’ foot steps. We also know that Christianity not only failed Jesus, but also failed Satan as it got corrupted by various human virtues such as mercy, compassion, and love. This is why Satan set Christianity aside, possessed Mahomet and founded Islam.
I feel so proud as a Indian & Ironic at the same time, with the kind of articles you are writing. ironic,because some unpatriotic elements are encouraging in diffusing the rich culture of India and yet you, someone who’s adopted India as your home, truly feels disturbed when trouble is at home. I guess not,but have you received any response to this letter?. May I suggest, you post this as a reply to one of his tweets?
@Swapzz 🙂
no, i have not received a reply and frankly did not expect one. i have tweeted the link to him several times. it may have reached.
Already in 1984 i wrote in German an article “Christianity – no thank you?” about the reaction of youngsters in Germany at that time, (from the the famous slogan “atomic power – no thank you”). so i may be already on some list of the Vatican…
Your letter is wonderful and comparison between the religious beliefs are really acceptable, what you wrote is bitter truth in india , especially in south india. The missionaries are exploiting mostly economically backward classes and isolated classes, Even I have be experienced. Your article is superb. . Thanks Madem
Believe in your way …
This is what Hindu philosophy all about
Great observation by Maria.
Many observed this truth but less people talk openly like this.
[…] https://mariawirthblog.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/open-letter-to-pope-francis/ […]
When is Pope Francis giving public proclaimation to treat every religion as equal?
Typically when a Christian preaches religious tolerance and harmony, they mean that (Islamic) nations should treat their Christian minorities better and not persecute them. They definitely do not mean that Christianity should respect other faiths or th…
Can we abolish Religion?
Simplistic reductionist question. Answer is NO. But we can definitely reform religions. Starting with getting rid of Proselytizing, which would reduce the friction points, between religions. https://mariawirthblog.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/open-letter-t…
Very educative writing.Thanks for sending the same
The letter is truly should be an eye opener for muslim as well as christains. What a hypocritical stand they take when it comes to religion. Being a major religions of the world, they dorectly or indirectly compete for patronage.
In 1968, I personally involved is a research project in untouchable community so, the missionary can explore the opportunities to indoctrinate untouchables by offering monetary benefits in return of alliance to their cause.
Pop goes around the world claiming to care for humanity (Selectively on a low profile basis).
It will be an educational and an eye opener for both religions to investigate how old is Hinduism. May be answer the absence of Christ.
I do not think one should hold the breath for any constructive change to take place any time soon.
Shantu
Perfectly straight, to the point, simple yet completely covering the issue of conversion. But will Pope understands and responds?
good article, but writer seems ill-informed about hinduism. He tends to equate hinduism with maya-advait sect of sri sankar which is 1 of many. This sect has been vociferously criticized for its logical fallacies and scriptural un-tenability. Writer is ,I guess, bemused by political correctness of neo-advait!!
your guess is wrong. i am not “bemused by political correctness of neo-advait”. For me, advaita (Kashmir Shaivism, and also Adi Shankara) makes sense. the ultimate, absolute truth (which can only be pointed at by words, but never expressed in words) is one.
on a relative level, dwaita is also true, but not absolutely true.
pls see https://mariawirthblog.wordpress.com/2013/08/17/blind-spot-of-modern-science/
So than you accept being biased in favour of Advait. Thats all I pointed out that Advait is not all of hinduism. It might be your personal favorite but we have had more than 1200 years when this school was first pointed out for its logical fallacies by other great masters belonging to other sects.
Now this is a monumental task to repeat all that in this forum so I apologies but the fact is that in india lately there are schools which are praised without being read and there are some which r criticized without being read.
try reading Gaudpad karika to see how close it is to madhyamika karika! It takes years of practice to even read it. Westerners tend to like it because of its exotic appeal not based on orthodox studies.
Though in classical india personal opinions are respected but scriptural validity is also very important. If you want to believe ‘…the ultimate ….is one’ thats fine I’am not challenging your democratic rights to do that.
But apart from that I do agree with the main theme of article. Christain proslytization is a big issue.
To add to your point here are some other dirty things you can add:
– Jesus Mudra of yoga
– Christian Bharatnatyam
– Secula manipuri dance
– Patients forced to declare their religion in hospitals run by missinaries.
many more. I admire your effort to speak.
my reaction was mainly to your charge of wanting to be “politically correct”, because this is surely not correct. i am straight forward and frank. i am used to being politically incorrect and certainly not afraid of it. This article shows what i mean http://mariawirthblog.wordpress.com/2014/02/25/is-hindu-dharma-good-and-hindutva-bad/
There is no spirituality left in organised missionary religions of the world. Real religion has to bring about a transformation of heart .. Such a heart is full of compassion, love, generosity and humility .. These qualities unfortunately rarely found in religious people from organised religions, but commonly found in the hearts of common Indians .. Such organised religions are therefore waste of resources and are not required to exist
[…] December 1o, 2013 · by MW · in Uncategorized · 93 Comments […]
‘@Maria Wirth: Swami Vivekananda said “It is mockery to offer religion to a starving man” He also anguished “What have we several million sanyasins been doing for the (starving) masses? Teaching them metaphysics? It is all madness …” Hinduism as an ideal which you wrote about is no longer prevalent in India. It died about 2000 years ago when the caste dominated culture got forcefully established during the Gupta period, the so called golden era of India. Perhaps that is why a messiah was born, though outside India, but surely influenced by the spiritual thoughts of that times. Christ spoke about the downtrodden, the masses, the underprivileged; if a recent book “Zealot” is to be believed, he even fought for their rights. In India, many many spiritual leaders came and went after that, no one raised their voices for the downtrodden and the lowest of the low. Indian history is written on the silent bodies of these victims.
What goes around, comes around, it is the unavoidable Karmic cycle. Since you believe in the Karmic equality, you will no doubt agree with me that India has to pay for the centuries of Brahminical oppression of its underprivileged. I see no reason to bemoan the fact that a smart Dalit is converting to Christianity (or Islam) to enjoy the benefits heaped on them by the church while retaining their Hindu identity to claim their rights under the reservation system. After all, isn’t that what the great Swami spoke about, to first feed the hungry mouths, to give the lowest of the low the ability to claim their rightful place with dignity and pride amongst the so called upper caste and privileged classes. How does it matter to Hinduism, which as you yourself said recognises that all religions are effectively different paths to the divine, if the convert places his trust in Christ as devoutly as he did in Ganesh or Krishna just a while back?
‘@Rational Guru: “There is no spirituality left in organised missionary religions …” You erred grievously my friend, when you put the word “missionary” there. If you eliminate that word, I agree with you in totality. All organised religions including the so called versions of Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism we see around are defunct and devoid of spirituality. They are all power centres, they provide “opium for the masses…” and collect heavy price for their addiction, price not always monetarily, but price by dragging down the collective progress of humanity towards a higher ground.
Wonderfully well written. My daughter’s ethics teacher doesn’t know much about Hinduism. Is this exact letter available in a German version? I think it would help me tremendously if I could share this with her, but in German. Some people in remote places of Europe haven’t heard of Hinduism and though in 2016, are much more open minded in their thinking, still could do with a lot more awareness.
[…] Source: Open Letter to Pope Francis […]
Reblogged this on sudhasarathi61 and commented:
sincere attempt in the name of God.
Dear Ms Wirth
Thank you for this effort at writing a letter to the Pope.
[…] Source: Open Letter to Pope Francis from India […]
well said, suchindra ji…very concise and deep..
Reblogged this on Hindu Internet Defence Force.
Hi Mariaji
I came across your letter only today as a followon to a facebook post and would like to express my appreciation for such a lucid, logical, sensible and appealing letter that should bring home the point to any balanced student of the Spiritual.
I particularly liked your outline of the power play between the different Middle-East faiths possibly determining the agenda for conversions in India.
Thanks.
[…] Source […]
Ms Maria Wirth seems to have completely misunderstood the essence of Christianity. Faith and Good Works go hand in hand. If we have faith, we cannot but do good works.
Bible scriptures:
For it is by Grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works
14 What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? 17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone..(James 2:14,17)
John 3:21
“But he who practices the truth comes to the Light,
James 2:26
For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.
Maria,
Thanks for writing such a bold and enlightened letter to His Holiness John Pope…
I’m happy to learn through the contents of your open letter to the Pope that How Christianity and Islamic institutions are working hard worldwide especially in Asia to convert the Hindus and paint the minds of millions into their religious colours… which unethical and must not be encouraged.
Hinduism is not a religion , its a way of life of highest life order. The pervasive caste system due to Brahamanical Order in Hindu Society must be condemned…. Otherwise, Hindus philosophy believes in VASUDHEOKUTUMBAKAM ( the whole world is a family), let live and let live….
Best Rgrds.
Dhruva kumar,LL.M
Lawyer, Sr.Broadcast Journalist, Intl Peace Builder
+91-9871706825 ,9835297757, 8709497635, 7678543831 dhruva4peace@gmail.com
Patna, bihar, india
Thank you.
regarding the caste system, I feel, it is overly maligned, as the division of work (its purpose) and the comparison with a body (all parts are valuable) in the Vedas is actually ingenious. Also, thanks to the introduction of a Brahmin caste which was to preserve and pass on the Vedas, at least a part of the Vedas is still available. Nowhere else in the world such long tradition persisted. Here I replied to a question on quora regarding Brahmins
https://www.quora.com/Do-Brahmins-feel-guilty-for-what-they-have-done-and-doing-to-India/answer/Maria-Wirth
I am wondering what gives Christianity a moral high ground to preach about Caste System? Did not Christianity (White Christian Nations) practice slavery, colonization and Inquisitions, where in they robbed colored people of their wealth and resources and stuck a bible in their hands after they were robbed? Isn’t the wealth of the white Christian nations and the Catholic church based on the wealth they robbed from people of color? Christianity has it’s own caste system of discrimination which is based on color. Put another way, Christianity has a color based caste system where the colored people are the slaves who will be constantly exploited by white people, the rulers / masters. Christianity gave itself the license to practice slavery (which is in the Bible) and colonialism under the dubious Doctrine of Divine Discovery. How come Christianity is attacking other Asian countries where there is no caste system, like Japan (Shinto Religion), Burma and Korea (Buddhism), etc. Christianity built its membership based on forced conversions through inquisitions, crusades, colonialism, forced and deceptive conversion and predatory conversions. They eliminated large sections of the native population of North and South America (Red Indians, Aztecs, Incas, etc.), Africa, Australia and then forcibly converted the remaining population using the “Sword or the Bible” approach. It is ironic that they attack non proselytizing peaceful religions like Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism, Sikhism, Shinto, etc. and brand them as fanatic or extremist when they refuse to convert or try to protect their ancestral and native religions. It is strange that a religion which resorted to killing, slavery and exploitation of Dalits (native population) of practically every continent today pretends to be the savior of the Dalits in India. If you go to West Indies you can see how Indians from India were brought as slaves and forced to work in Banana plantations and then forced to convert to Christianity. These Indians far from their native lands were forced to marry African slaves and the children born to them could not join schools or get an identity until they converted to Christianity. The Oppression of Ango-Saxon-White-Christians is a million folds worse than the so called Brahamanical oppression. Look at the history of White Christian global killing, ethnical cleansing, robbery, rape and pillage under license and encouragement from Christianity.
I always wonder why is Kerala sinking into the Desert Dogma hell? Half the Malayali’s are Christian and the other half have become Muslims. Both these Dogmas are obsessed with their one prophet one book nonsense and both are either fighting each other for world dominance or harassing Pagans and Kafirs by trying to convert them and rob them. Why can’t you leave them alone? The word Religion is too generic a word which unfairly puts tyrannical predatory dogmas like Islam and Christianity in the same bucket as peaceful non proselytizing spiritual practices like Buddhism, Jainism, Hindusim, Shintoism.
The British (White Christians) barely left us 60 years ago after stripping our nation of its wealth and resources to the bone, creating holocaust in Bengal and ethnic / racial cleansing across the country and you think these folks are your saviors. If India was merely a land of tribal and dalits they all would have been killed by European Christians long back and our country would have been occupied by white Christians just like they did in North and South America and Australia.
Excellent work Maria ji, true like mirror what Christianity think and acts.Every where you see mushrooming of Church and Mosque .
They believe in
building their faith Tall ,More Visible more Audible.Sending markers for Conversion in professional way.
Hindu who are innocent, ignorant of Religious knowledge, having problems of life and searched and converted for Need base ,Money, treatment,food, education and Love.
Hindu need to be educated about His Religion, Strength,Glory and self identify.
They need to stand up on works of Humanity helpful to society deep penetration into each house hold to bring them strength and free from superstitions from church used like DVD treatment etc.
Please educate the innocent
Help the needy
Compassion and Love for new world.
Namaste Maria ji
[…] Open Letter to Pope Francis from India […]
[…] My friend Maria Wirth writes on religion https://mariawirthblog.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/open-letter-to-pope-francis/ […]
He didn’t reply and won’t reply. But it surely reached him. Apart from sending it registered, he got many many tweets.
This letter is really a great initiative towards ideal Hinduism!! Hinduism is Sarvadharmasapekshta, it’s not exclusive but all inclusive, it believes in live and let live, true believers of Vasudhaiva Kutumbakam!! I loved your letter dear Ms Maria Writh!! God has blessed the world with enough of place for Each and every one to follow once own ideology!! Just try to add some consciousness, love, care, & respect others and other religions too!!
nice interpretation to a new understanding.
My respected Sister,I am very happy and greatful to you . God may you live long as you may serve the ultimate truth.
Very impressive letter, of course. I am also, from long years, demanding an anti-conversion law with the name of “freedom of religion act” which will allow any conversions only on individual basis, with a duly attested affidavit filed by the desiring-to-convert [to other religion] person and scrutinized and approved by a judicial magistrate, and that conversion not binding on his/her spouse either who has again to decide independently and in any case not on children at all who until maturity would continue in their born religion and culture, and for that, if necessary, the State may take over their custody and care. CERTAINLY, THERE IS NO MEANING AND NO NECESSITY AT ALL FOR CHRISTIAN OR ISLAMIC MISSIONARIES OR CLERICS SPENDING HUGE AMOUNTS OF MONEY AND OFFERING INDUCEMENTS AND EVEN AT TIMES ENGAGING IN FRAUDS ETC FOR MASS CONVERSIONS WHICH SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED. In the secular democratic socialist republic (as the constitutional ideal spells) of India all religious communities/groups can live in harmony and tolerance without the need for any excessive zeal or fanaticism for conversions of other religionists.
Excellent and bold letter with adequate knowledge of both religions. Thanks.
[…] has been almost 4 years since this article was first published by Maria ji on her blog. In that period, Pope Francis has made several trips to Asia covering countries like Sri Lanka, […]
Can there be a more enlightening lesson to all who misinterpret Sanatana Dharma?
Brilliantly said though i doubt anything’s going to change.
[…] By: Maria Wirth (This letter is borrowed with thanks from HERE) […]
Excellent
[…] https://mariawirthblog.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/open-letter-to-pope-francis/amp/ […]
Truthful,courageous,admirable.l as an Indian feel proud of you for writing against the Vatican disregard,disrespect towards Hinduism.Thank you ma’am we are grateful to you
You are living in the middle age.
Most of catholics do not believe the world has been made in 6 days and that pagans deserve to die. Like most of hindus do not believe that to have the right to enter a mandir, one have to be a male brahmin, not a white female.
Come on…
Dear Mariawirth ji, Your blog is so beautifully written that I do not know if there is anything left to say. I come from Kerala where I am pained by self righteousness of the church and its followers. It is totally ok for them to borrow from our rich culture- Jesus with bindi, Jesus on ratham, Kodi Maram (so unique to Hidnu temples of Kerala and so beautiful), etc. I had no fight with borrowing from this rich culture as long as they would stop the culture of wanting to convert. I am happy to add Jesus as the Muppathi Mukkodi Plus 1 one god to our pantheon of gods, but I am upset by this self righteous and sanctimonious approach after doing all that and preaching a greater truth than what our culture ever taught us….I do not visit temples on my own expect accompanying my family but I have always had this strong connect to Hinduisim as if in the sense of a community….and they just strengthen me and my resolve every day…
Dear Ms Maria
I strongly appreciate your letter and the concern you had about the humanity. It’s more important for the humanity to survive then the religion as you rightly said above.
Warm regards
Very well written letter to the Pope, hope he replies. I would like to place here excerpts from my forthcoming book “KNowing the Self, Discovering the Mind…” as follows:
Monotheistic religions posited their belief on an all-powerful god which was all purity but were unable to explain the cause behind human suffering, hence developed the concept of duality- God, and Satan. It was Ahriman in the monotheistic Zoroastrian religion, Satan in Christianity, and Shaitan or Iblis in Islam. Collectively let us call these forces as ‘anti-god’. Once again, we consider what is life? Is it all pleasure, all peaceful, all joyous, and without suffering? Can the all-powerful, pious and pristine God endow sufferings for mankind? Obviously, the suggestion that God may be the author for man’s suffering is unthinkable because he is considered ‘All Pure’ and merciful. But the fact is that there are misery, difficulties, and sorrow in one’s life. Therefore, to explain away the perpetrator of misery and sorrow one invented the concept of anti-god. How the all-powerful god (in monotheistic religions) could have allowed anti-god to stand in the competition, remains unexplained. For any untoward happenings who do you blame? The all-powerful pristine God, or the Satan, or your karma, or your misdoings? If you posit human sufferings on Satan then universal power of God is questioned, if you posit it on your own misdoings then you believe on the doctrine of karma which monotheistic religions reject! And, sufferings cannot be posited on all pristine pure God-the Absolute Truth. It has to be placed squarely on another divinity, and since the human mind cannot accept that misery can visit a person engineered by God, he finds the cause in an Anti-God. As against such concepts, polytheistic religions have a deistic and karmic approach, so as not to posit everything, every suffering on the Almighty as He is supposed to be pure without the human attribute. The deistic and karmic approach has its own advantage. If a person suffers in poverty perhaps goddess Lakshmi has not been benevolent on him, if a person remains poor in studies perhaps goddess Saraswati has not been benign. If there is continuous suffering it is the karma that may have played truant. Thus, shortcomings and sufferings are posited on different deities and one’s own karma rather on the Almighty. Thus, Almighty is indemnified from negativity.
another important point is that Christianity and Islam claim there is only one life. so this makes it all the more difficult to understand why a child should be born with deformities, for example. yet having many lives, which makes sense on the appearance level, helps in explaining it as karma and just a passing phase. in the end all reach the oneness with Atman/ Brahman, which is always there, but just not felt due to sense deceptions and the veil of thoughts.
That is right, MW. Philosophy of Karma has been discussed in my previous book – “Karma, its Relevance and Applicability in Day-to-Day Life”. It is the sanchita karma that migrates with the soul and appears to apply in the next reincarnation, next birth.
[…] Open Letter to Pope Francis from India […]
Reality bites. Church won’t aswer Maria for sure. Bunch of hypocrites
they can’t admit… they may see the point
This, you are saying to the Pope at a time when he is cleverly trying to cut a sweet deal with Modi as a master stroke, a panacea for all their logistical & social bottlenecks, by which they can vastly improve efficiency of conversion activities, by offering Modi the political support that can further solidify his position & probably offering to take him to the higher scales of international awards & even getting the likes of WaPo/NYT to sing praises of him such that international rating agencies recognize India’s “potential” & funds start pouring in & his dream of “sab ka saat….” is also made feasible! Can your small sense prevail in front of such gigantic calculations?
Very well articulated. Hope the Christians in general and Pope in particular will show the courage to srap the dogmas that divide the humanity into beleivers, who get the ticket to heaven, and heathens who are damned to burn in hell for ever.
[…] link to the full letter: https://mariawirthblog.wordpress.com/2013/12/11/open-letter-to-pope-francis/ […]
Urging Pope Francis to promote true religious respect and unity, beyond exclusivity. ✨🌍 #InterfaithHarmony
Without exclusivity, without claiming that only Jesus and the Church can save, it would be like a branch of Hindu Dharma.
Jesus himself did not mention the first commandment “you shall not have other Gods before me” when he was asked how to gain the kingdom of God.
he started with love your neighbor like yourself, and then don’t steal, kill, etc..
Exclusivity and conversion are the poison injected by the Church.
But the Church probably won’t give up its power…